River and Whitewater Data Feeds

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Title Content Published Date Site Location
Looking for a Good Starter Creeker I am 5' 11'' and 165lbs Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Speed rail fitting failure Its always smart to check. How old are your fittings? Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Found: Kayak paddle Dowd Chute The Chute is in. I was boating it on Monday, a little low but definitely not bad. Tyson's was boofable but the levels have seem to drop off the last... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
12 volt pump for water fights. This is what I'd want....(see video below) If you don't have a spare $30k you could always just buy a washdown pump. Could come in handy at the... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Whitewater Forum : Sky lap Author: outdoorjunkie88
Subject: Sky lap
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 11:10am

Sounds good. Looks like there will be a few. I'm aiming for 4:30 but if traffic is bad then 5.
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Whitewater Forum : Biginners Author: NateW
Subject: Biginners
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 11:23am

I'm betting that the best new kayaker run for you would be the green. I'm not really sure the best way to connect with folks in that area since I'm a 509er. You should look into going to the Green River cleanup as I bet you'd meet lots of folks there.

http://www.greenrivercleanup.org/register-for-the-clean-up/

If there is a roll session in your area, this would be another way to hook up with newer paddlers. I saw your posts on the other thread about the Wenatchee. It's a good new paddler option if you make it out here.

Edited by NateW - Today at 11:23am
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
River of Sorrow screening at Down River We have reached capacity for the screening of a River of Sorrow. 65 people have RSVP'd. This is going to be a great event. You can sign up on the... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Marsh Creek? Salmon-Challis National Forest - Water Activities (http://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/scnf/recreation/wateractivities/?cid=stelprdb5302105) First... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Speed rail fitting failure ---Quote (Originally by zbaird)--- Was freezing a potential cause? ---End Quote--- Possibly... I leave the frame outside all winter and I'm in... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
2016 Tahiti Body Board Suring Challenge Waves forecast to almost double from morning size, about 3-7, PST 11am. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzJsFBuDPAQ Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Whitewater Forum : Biginners Author: SkyFall
Subject: Biginners
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 11:50am

yeah, actually I have 3 more paddlers going this sunday to the powerhouse. doing class II since we are all new to kayaking. One experience paddler coming too. and today I'm also going to the post on "sky lap". and probably doing the green river clean up, too, in order to meet more paddlers. Thanks
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Whitewater Forum : Biginners Author: megspk
Subject: Biginners
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 12:44pm

In reference to the Sky: Split rock to Big Eddy is a more challenging class 2+ section of the Sky (more than the Sky to Baring section). The main (Confluence to Split Rock) is great class 3, with Boulder Drop (big class 4), in the middle. It's portageable.
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Whitewater Forum : Biginners Author: megspk
Subject: Biginners
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 12:41pm

The Green River Clean up is a great idea! There will be many skill levels there.

You can also connect thru WKC (Washington Kayak Club) if you are looking for guaranteed beginner paddles with safety.

I met many of my paddling peeps here on PP. There are also several Facebook groups to help people connect.

I like heading out with beginners too! This week I am not able to paddle very much cause my mom is in town, but I'd be down in the future.

There's a great class 2 section on the Skykomish, with one 2+/3- rapid. You paddle from Skykomish (the town) to Baring. Just be sure you know the take out, there is class 5 down the river from Baring.
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Whitewater Forum : Pool sessions? Author: megspk
Subject: Pool sessions?
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 12:35pm

I think they're all dried up for the winter :( Someone said the Monroe one goes year round, but I don't have any info on that (but I'd like some)!
UPS has a calendar on their Facebook page that they post.
I think last summer Leavenworth had them at their outdoor pool, but I'm not sure if that's a go this summer.
There's always the lake!
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
A cautionary tale on cat frames and toe bars. Thank you MTTODD. I appreciate it. Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Speed rail fitting failure ---Quote (Originally by nastysauce)--- Lo pros suck in my opinion. At 13 a tee it's half the cost of a lo pro that will eat flesh. Just my... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Navajo Operations Update- San Juan River 4/7/16 I don't get another forecast until next week but based on the current weather around here, it's cool and snowy, so the melt hasn't really gotten... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Aire Super Puma on MF Salmon this June? my father once told me, "son, dont be a pussy". ps. super puma dont flip check avitar Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Whitewater Forum : Comment Period has Closed. Now What? Author: jP
Subject: Comment Period has Closed. Now What?
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 12:57pm

Re: FERC Project # 14295, the So-Called Sunset Falls "Fish Passage" and Energy Project on the South Fk Skykomish River...

I'm starting this thread as a follow up now that the 90 day comment period regarding Snohomish County PUD's Draft License Application has come to a close. This thread will include a summary report of my own conclusions after reading nearly every single comment that has been posted to FERC Dockett #P-14295.This includes the filings from the various concerned agencies and NGO's who've had a stake or otherwise vested interest in this process and its outcome.

For now I want to thank anyone and everyone who filed a comment, mailed a comment, helped to engage others to comment, or otherwise actively contributed to the much needed opposition to this wrong headed idea to place a hydro project smack dab in the middle of a Wild And Scenic river. I feel that the best way to thank everyone is to shed light on some freshly tallied numbers. These numbers offer up some much needed encouragement and quite possibily point to some potential victory at some point in the future, though it is also important to note this thing is a long way from over. No chickens have hatched, so we can't really count them. The Fox has been in the henhouse since long before James G. Watt showed up on the scene and is apparently still at it. I was a kid then, still preoccupied w/ Star Wars but I remember sitting in front of the TV and clearly something was rotten in Denmark. My old man JR had an American Rivers sticker on the back of his S-10 pickup and informed me about what an ass hatt Mr. Watt was and his destructive policies.

So JR is the first person I want to thank for showing me the writing on the wall early, not to mention teaching me how to kayak. Actually DP is right beside him because she always taught me that principles of non violence were the guidelines to be followed whenever trying to get something meaningful done for the greater good. Turns out after life's many twists and turns and losing all of my worldly possesions at least twice, those tools are still in the toolbox afterall. They are indespensible and can't be taken away by anyone.

HEYBROOK LIVES!!!
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Whitewater Forum : Biginners Author: SkyFall
Subject: Biginners
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 12:52pm

Thanks for the great info. hope to paddle with you some time soon.
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Whitewater Forum : 31st Annual GREEN RIVER CLEANUP - 4/30 Author: megspk
Subject: 31st Annual GREEN RIVER CLEANUP - 4/30
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 12:46pm

How low was it last year? 527 seems REALLY low, or do you expect a release for the weekend? Just curious!
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Whitewater Forum : Comment Period has Closed. Now What? Author: jP
Subject: Comment Period has Closed. Now What?
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 1:23pm

Ok- the rough number:

One of the Seven Samurai who I get my marching orders from is Andrea Matzke. Yesterday near the end of the deadline she dropped the mountain of petitions in FERC's already swamped lap. The combined total of paper and online signatures presses up against the 7,000 mark.

7,000 individuals have spoken out against this since 2012!

Add to that the appoximate numbers...

- 97 online comments from Sierra Club Members
- over 500 (easily. Accurate totals were had to keep a grip on- possibly 600 or more) Comment Cards. Those of you who helped us get those out to concerned people deserve a HUGE pat on the back!
- definitely more than 79 online comments during this last 90 day round, the majority of those are from paddlers. A notable amount of those paddlers from out of state.

That gets us within range of 8,000 voices of Opposition.

Another Sky Samurai, Lora Cox, summarized these totals nicely in one of her FERC comments.

Incidently I forgot the paper I wrote all those numbers so precisely on. Will come back and update this particular post, but suffice to say,

Like every ripple, wave and hydraulic adds to the symphonic choir of The River, FERC has now heard the Thunderous Roar of Mighty Mama Skykomish and her Indefatigable Spirit- THROUGH US! Because these suits who are charged with deciding her fate are far removed from her banks, and The River Can't Speak For Herself!
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Whitewater Forum : Comment Period has Closed. Now What? Author: jP
Subject: Comment Period has Closed. Now What?
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 1:34pm

To those of you who did not comment at all for whatever reason, I am sorry you missed an opportunity to add your voice to this Floodstage of a Chorus. A sense of optimism is being felt right now. But if this beast lumbers on toward the Final License Application, those who missed this crucial comment period will absolutely be needed to weigh in later. Personally I hope this project gets SQUASHED NOW so none of us need such an opportunity. Here I gotta emphasize that our strong presence of expression was critical during this phase, and is now a solid documented expression to build upon moving forward.

With regards to where the agencies come down on, all this,
I plan to compile a summary of that too real soon. The main take away being that while the agencies obviously didn't just say no, several outlined requirements and procedures as of yet unfulfilled by the PUD with an unfavorable tone that, while vaguely detectable in some ways shows signs if encouragement. Like I said though...
More of that later. Stay tuned as your interest level allows, but a major push has been achieved! Now its just a matter of sitting back and waiting for the other shoe to drop.

Edited by jP - Today at 1:41pm
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Speed rail fitting failure ---Quote (Originally by elkhaven)--- I wasn't meaning just you. Lots of people pin them. I guess I should have elaborated.... You really would... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
A cautionary tale on cat frames and toe bars. Hmmmm. This thread could be titled, "A cautionary tale on dirt bike frames and handle bars." Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Middle Fork Salmon questions... I did it as a self support at high water a few years ago too... Awesome trip, but very manageable for a class IV boater and even class III boater.... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
San Juan - Several Spaces Available S.I. - C.H. 5/7 - 5/14 Pm sent Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Ever torn your shoulder labrum? I've had labrum repairs on both shoulders. First one was popping out all time so surgery was a must after a year of initial injury. Other one just... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Whitewater Forum : 31st Annual GREEN RIVER CLEANUP - 4/30 Author: JoesKayak
Subject: 31st Annual GREEN RIVER CLEANUP - 4/30
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 1:52pm

I forget the exact number but it was around 400 last year. Guess what. The Green is still fun at that level and there were boats in all 3 main sections.

there will not be a release, that is, above inflow. Currently water is being held back to fill the res and it is just about full so hopefully we'll get inflow so at least levels in the high hundreds.
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Whitewater Forum : Upper Sultan Problems Author: cchollnd
Subject: Upper Sultan Problems
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 1:49pm

Hey guys, I was one of the people that pre-registered and then didn't show up. I was using the sultan as a back-up in case robe spiked above my comfort zone. I did not understand the negative impacts of my actions on the PUD and future releases. It won't happen again, and I'll spread the word to others.
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Whitewater Forum : Biginners Author: NateW
Subject: Biginners
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 2:26pm

Make sure you and all your beginner buddies have airbags in your boats. I would encourage you to hold off on running the classIII/IV section of the Sky until you've got a good amount of time on mellower class II/III. The Sky is a pretty challenging river especially at the ~4000CFS range even if you walk boulder drop.
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Ever torn your shoulder labrum? I have two SLAP tears, obviously one in each shoulder. Overuse in the left from guiding and paddling, right torn after a wipe out surfing and having... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Navajo Operations Update- San Juan River 4/7/16 That's good news! Hopefully the run off is big this year! Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Speed rail fitting failure Bottom line is I have to fix it. Speedrail fittings are hard to find in canada but we do have a local retailer here (finally) who stocks some NRS... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Lower Owyhee Tow/paddle out? Any idea what is causing recent spike? Don't know area well enough to know if its rain related, rain on snow or higher elevation melt-off? Still... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Whitewater Forum : Comment Period has Closed. Now What? Author: JoesKayak
Subject: Comment Period has Closed. Now What?
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 3:13pm

Thank you, JP for spearheading the efforts for the paddling community. I'm very happy to see our community step up to speak for the river. I truly hope that this project is squashed at this stage (and looking though all the documents I've looked though I would certainly hope it does).

If not, the next stage we'll really need to reach out to other recreational groups. The anglers and the hikers especially. We are a small group. Those groups are much much bigger and have the same interest as us in keeping rivers and other natural places unspoiled. We had a nice spring snowmelt level of comments, but if this goes further we'll need a November pineapple express flood of comments.
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Whitewater Forum : Comment Period has Closed. Now What? Author: JoesKayak
Subject: Comment Period has Closed. Now What?
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 3:18pm

Originally posted by jP

To those of you who did not comment at all for whatever reason, I am sorry you missed an opportunity to add your voice to this Floodstage of a Chorus. A sense of optimism is being felt right now. But if this beast lumbers on toward the Final License Application, those who missed this crucial comment period will absolutely be needed to weigh in later. Personally I hope this project gets SQUASHED NOW so none of us need such an opportunity. Here I gotta emphasize that our strong presence of expression was critical during this phase, and is now a solid documented expression to build upon moving forward.

With regards to where the agencies come down on, all this,
I plan to compile a summary of that too real soon. The main take away being that while the agencies obviously didn't just say no, several outlined requirements and procedures as of yet unfulfilled by the PUD with an unfavorable tone that, while vaguely detectable in some ways shows signs if encouragement.

The NWPCC outlined procedures required for PUD to obtain an "Exception" to their ruling that Sunset is within a Protected Area. As in Protected From Hydro. They noted that PUD has not begun to engage that process, and invited them to. So that's rather opaque to me but the process as outlined is detailed.

DOE came out saying it has no plans of loosening the Instream Flow Rule, meaning PUD can't leagally drain the bypass reach down to 250 cfs like they want to. Technically they can proceed, but it means less draw through the proposed intake and therefore less power generated, and at increased cost making the whole idea pretty silly.

Like I said though...
More of that later. I was 100% caught up as of last night but there is a fresh mountain to read through that could easily keep me busy till early next week, including another DOE comment and another from AW. And meanwhile Mr. Rainey and the other Sky Samurai probably have more in there that I havent got to.Stay tuned as your interest level allows, but a major push has been achieved! Now its just a matter of sitting back and waiting for the other shoe to drop.




I read the NW power and conservation council's commets with great interest as well.

Basically they're saying, they have say as to where projects like this get built, backed up by Federal law and they say no to development on this river.

And the only way they would grant an exception is if PUD can show that the project will cause a exceptional benefit to fish and wildlife. Yeah. Good luck with that. Like you said, PUD hasn't even applied for that exception.
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Whitewater Forum : Comment Period has Closed. Now What? Author: jP
Subject: Comment Period has Closed. Now What?
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 3:50pm

Originally posted by JoesKayak

We had a nice spring snowmelt level of comments, but if this goes further we'll need a November pineapple express flood of comments.



well said dude-

UpDate: so I got a little more detail to dump on this thread about Agency Responses. I got all caught up on every comment submitted by individuals, not one of which supports the project, BTW. Next I skim read the final Agency Filings, most of which are a minimum of 3 pages.

The most encouraging input I've read so far comes from both the Snoqualmie and Tulalip Tribes. Snoqualmie simply took two pages to Clearly say "No Way".
Tulalip evidently took 25 pages, but I didn't read it all. I skimmed down a bit to get a sense of the content, then back up to page two where I read the following:"The Tulalip Tribes strongly recommend that the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission deny this application."

I find the stance of both Tribes VERY encouraging and welcome feedback from anyone on this forum who has any quantitative guage or impressions of how much weight this will have. Early next week I will retrace my steps and thoroughly read all these last minute Agency Filings with particular interest in what Tulalip has to say. It is a thorough report. And I sh*t you not if this think gets stopped in its tracks at this phase I will most certainly compose a sincere thank you letter and send it to both Tribal agencies.

I'm hopeful, but as we all know there is always another sequel to "Friday The 13th", "Halloween" or, the most horrific movie of all for the Sky to have to star in, "A Nightmare on California Street"

I will not be satisfied until I can dance on the grave of P-14295.

Edited by jP - Today at 3:51pm
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Speed rail fitting failure ---Quote (Originally by PhilipJFry)--- funny, you don't have to be spot on for LoPro fittings.. 1 5/8" fence tubing fits them just fine, and an... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Lower Owyhee Tow/paddle out? The spike is due to the recent rains.. We took off on Monday and had a great trip.. Had one terrible windy day and some pretty bad wind on the last... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Whitewater Forum : Comment Period has Closed. Now What? Author: jP
Subject: Comment Period has Closed. Now What?
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 4:45pm

Haha that last image conjures up the lyrics of Dillon's Masters of War, though actually I think I prefer Eddie Vedder's rendition. Dillon definitely has the corner on the market as far as "Last Thoughts On Woody Guthrie" is concerned.

Anyway, regardless of the outcome of this Draft License Application is concerned, if we truly want to ensure that a sequel to "A Nightmare On California Street" doesn't come "soon to a river near you", we have more work to do for sure.

Megan mentioned this not long ago (one of many reasons why you are awesome, Megan!)-

As far as the Sky goes, we need to get out of reactive mode and shift into proactive mode. We need to push and get the Sky the federal protection is qualifies for so this can't ever trouble us again. Yup this is a discussion to have w/ AW. Not trying to reinvent any wheels here.

To succeed with that effort is going to require involvement from us. So this is the answer to the question in the title of this thread "What Now?" Not that its gotta happen right-the-FERC-Now!, but it needs to happen. This is abzurd (say that w/ a british accent- that's why the z is there. FERCin Brits! When are they gonna learn to speak English, anywsy?)

And, the last answer to the "What Now?" question beyond Joe's answer concerns Ernies Gorge on the N fk Snoqualmie.
I say kill two Dams with one letter, more or less. I regret I have been so focused on Sunset that the DLA for Ernies recently blew right past us. I'm not even informed of where things are at in that process, but no boater thus far has really stayed on top of it. I know the FLA phase for Ernies has not yet approached.

I pledge right here and now to help in that effort as well, but someone has to legitimately rally on that one. Its harder to engage because it almost seems like the class II-IV demographic has a (shrug)"What's in it for me?" Attitude awhile back when I tried to beat that drum.

So like it or not- and this is aimed at the Class V boaters: this is soley their baby and they will need to approach me or I'll just say "FERC it. If these FERC'n Class V kidz don't care about saving one of washington's class V crown jewels, let it go" but in reality I can't really adopt that attitude that's just me talking sh*t to reintroduce a dash of "jP classic" into the dialog.
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Whitewater Forum : Comment Period has Closed. Now What? Author: jP
Subject: Comment Period has Closed. Now What?
Posted: 28 Apr 2016 at 4:47pm

Seriously, whether the comments influence the outcome or not, its our only mechanism to effect change.

So my closing statement for now is that despite my sh*t talkin ways, I have always valued the ecclectic and rich mix of demographics that comprise our sport and the culture that is a product of it. And I firmly believe with every molocule of water in my body that We as a collective group are intrinsicly predisposed to be able to effect change in regards to these matters. Why? Because our time on the river changes us in subtle yet powerful ways. Not only as individuals and how we respond and approach situations, but perhaps more noticably as loose groups of semi autonomous units. Think about it.

Our time on the river quickly bonds us to one another out of necessity. As we adapt to an environment historicaly hostile to humans, over time without even being aware of it, these adaptations are habit forming and expand as we move through the world off the river.

I'm saying as a soft counter point to Joe's point that we are a small group, that we all share unique untapped potential to be a very focused, and productive group. But since we don't attempt to tackle these larger goals often, perhaps few of us within our (paddling) community are aware of just what our combined energies and strengths really are.

Somebody please feel free to copy any of this if it resonates with you and sling it out over FB. I don't require credit for having said it. But I believe deep down there really is something to this, and I would encourage the entire paddling community to reflect on this, and more importantly explore it through action.

We would never want to reverse the river's flow, but we can influence the flow of public opinion more than we realize. But we gotta step out of our myopic focus of our selfish Pursuits Of Boof and talk to the "normal people" we meet along our adventures.

Edited by jP - Today at 4:51pm
Professor Paddle Washington, Oregon and vicinity
Marsh Creek? That's great. Thanks!! Sent from my iPhone using Mountain Buzz Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Middle Fork Salmon questions... I would go with the 15 degree bag better to have than not, your going to be glad you did. Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Moab daily Just Ran it on Friday. Hittle Bottom to Take Out Beach. I hitched back to Hittle Bottom. Caught a ride in 5 minutes. You will have no problem. ... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Speed rail fitting failure ---Quote (Originally by cupido76)--- How tight should the fit be for lowpros in the 1.25" schedule 40? I read something on the NRS website about... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
A cautionary tale on cat frames and toe bars. I am going to keep putting my toes in my foot bar because I imagine the number of times it has kept me from swimming far out numbers the once in a... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Riken Nez Perce SB Floor I am in need of a Riken Nez Perce floor. It's a self bailer manufactured in 1987. The glue in original floor has given up the ghost. Would be... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Speed rail fitting failure ---Quote (Originally by cupido76)--- Good food for thought... thanks. I suppose one more point in support of speed rail fittings that are not... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else
Big Creek in 4 days (including flight in) possible? I'm looking to get a Big Creek trip planned for early June and wondering about the logistics. I've read a few blogs from people who've done it and... Mountain Buzz Colorado, Western US and everywhere else